Virtual Dhamma-Vinaya Vihara

Open monastery, laity practice area- [Öffentliches Kloster, Laienpraxisbereich] (vata assama) => Admirable friend - [Großartiger Freund] kalyanamittata => Topic started by: Dhammañāṇa on August 20, 2019, 04:25:30 PM

Title: Der Erhabene Buddha als der größte Angeber, und das Fehlen von Eifersucht
Post by: Dhammañāṇa on August 20, 2019, 04:25:30 PM
"Der Erhabene Buddha als der größter An-geber und das Fehlen von Eifer-sucht"... was mag einem da durch den Kopf gehen, berührt von solcher Ansage?
Title: Re: Der Erhabene Buddha als der größte Angeber, und das Fehlen von Eifersucht
Post by: Moritz on August 21, 2019, 02:15:39 PM
"Der Erhabene Buddha als der größter An-geber und das Fehlen von Eifer-sucht"... was mag einem da durch den Kopf gehen, berührt von solcher Ansage?

Vandami Bhante _/\_ _/\_ _/\_


"Der Erhabene Buddha als der größter An-geber ..."

Dazu fällt mir ein:

Namo tassa bhagavato arahato sammā-sambuddhassa

// ... //

"Als dies gesagt war, antwortete ich Upaka, dem Ajivaka in den Versen:

'All-siegend
allwissend bin ich,
in Bezug auf alle Dinge
   anhanglos.
All-aufgebend
Losgelöst im Enden des Verlangens:
vollständig aus mir selbt heraus,
auf wen sollte ich als meinen Lehrer zeigen? [4]

Ich habe keinen Lehrer,
und einer wie ich kann nicht gefunden werden.
In der Welt mit ihren Devas,
habe ich keinesgleichen.

Denn ich bin ein Arahant in der Welt;
   Ich, der unübertreffliche Lehrer.
   Ich allein bin rechtmäßig selbsterwacht.
Gekühlt bin ich, ungebunden.

Um das Rad des Dhamma ins Rollen zu bringen
gehe ich in die Stadt Kasi.
In einer Welt, die blind geworden,
schlage ich die Trommel des Todlosen.'

"'Deinen Behauptungen zufolge, mein Freund, musst du ein unendlicher Eroberer sein.'

'Eroberer sind jene wie ich,
die haben erreicht der Gärungen Ende.
Ich habe erobert böse Eigenschaften,
und so, Upaka, bin ich ein Eroberer.'

"Als dies gesagt war, sagte Upaka: 'Mag es so sein, mein Freund', und — indem er seinen Kopf schüttelte und eine Seitenstraße nahm — ging er davon.

// ... //
Quote from: AN 26: Die edle Suche (http://zugangzureinsicht.org/html/tipitaka/mn/mn.026.than.html)


"... und das Fehlen von Eifer-sucht"

Dazu fällt mir ein:

Namo tassa bhagavato arahato sammā-sambuddhassa

"Bhikkhus, I do not dispute with the world [the 'world' in the sense of other people], the world disputes with me: no one who proclaims the True Idea [dhamma] disputes with anyone in the world. What wise men in the world say there is not [natthi], that I too say there is not; and what wise men in the world say there is [atthi], that I too say there is... Wise men in the world say there is no permanent, everlasting, eternal materiality not subject to change, and I too say there is none. [And likewise with the other four categories.] Wise men in the world say that there is impermanent materiality that is unpleasant and the subject to change, and I too say there is that."
Quote from: SN 22.94 (http://zugangzureinsicht.org/html/lib/authors/various/wheel186_en.html#theravada)

_/\_ _/\_ _/\_
Title: Re: Der Erhabene Buddha als der größte Angeber, und das Fehlen von Eifersucht
Post by: Dhammañāṇa on August 21, 2019, 02:34:32 PM
Sadhu, Sadhu.

Eifer-sucht, daß Wort einfach genommen, ist ja etwas fundamental Wichtiges um sich auf den Pfad zu geben und dem Buddha und Noblen Nachzueifern. Zur unerschütterlichen Sucht wird es für den Niemehrwiederkehrer, die Fessel des Fehlens von Eifer abgeschnitten.

Warum auch diesrs Wort so sehr an seiner Bedeutung verloren hat... Gut ist's sich wahren Angebern hinzugeben und eifersüchtig nach wahrlich Erstrebenswerten zu sein.
Title: Re: Der Erhabene Buddha als der größte Angeber, und das Fehlen von Eifersucht
Post by: Moritz on August 21, 2019, 02:40:54 PM
_/\_ _/\_ _/\_
Title: Re: Der Erhabene Buddha als der größte Angeber, und das Fehlen von Eifersucht
Post by: អរិយវង្ស on August 22, 2019, 11:24:03 AM
Sadhu Sadhu  _/\_ _/\_ _/\_
Title: Re: Der Erhabene Buddha als der größte Angeber, und das Fehlen von Eifersucht
Post by: Dhammañāṇa on August 22, 2019, 11:58:35 AM
That Nyom Cheav Villa can take more fully part (Atma is a terrible word-player, using it in Khmer also often as she knows, which causes many with less flexibility to get fast angry)

German language, as an Indo-German, from Sanskrit, is actually a very deep language and here there is a "provocative" word-play.

"An-geber", "an" means "for, before, in front", "geber" means giver. So Angeber is someone who lead, someone who gives a sample. Yet the word Angeber is aly used to descripe a "poser", ខ្លែងហើរ, sadly in general (because of marxist cultur - all are/must be equal).

So common people would see one called Angeber as very bad. And U[asaka Moritz showed by the first sutta how normal people react on meeting the Buddha and good follower.

"Eifersucht", "Eifer" means "effort", "sucht" means "passion". Normally the world is a negative one, used in a meaning of jealousy. Marxist need to be content and not strife for more sublime. Therefore "passion after effort" has a bad notion in modern, western world.

Upasaka Moritz showed with the second sutta that the Buddha, althought the highest "Angeber", is already free of any "Eifersucht" in both meanings.

Yet Atma pointed another time out that proper "Eifersucht" (ច្រណែន) and conceit is needed for the path: "If he, by human effort, could reach it, why shouldn't I can." as for example pointed out in the Bhikkhuni Sutta.

Namo tassa bhagavato arahato sammā-sambuddhassa

..."'This body, sister, comes into being through food. And yet it is by relying on food that food is to be abandoned.' Thus was it said. And in reference to what was it said? There is the case, sister, where a monk, considering it thoughtfully, takes food — not playfully, nor for intoxication, nor for putting on bulk, nor for beautification — but simply for the survival & continuance of this body, for ending its afflictions, for the support of the holy life, [thinking,] 'Thus will I destroy old feelings [of hunger] and not create new feelings [from overeating]. I will maintain myself, be blameless, & live in comfort.' Then, at a later time, he abandons food, having relied on food. 'This body, sister, comes into being through food. And yet it is by relying on food that food is to be abandoned.' Thus was it said, and in reference to this was it said.

"'This body comes into being through craving. And yet it is by relying on craving that craving is to be abandoned.' Thus was it said. And in reference to what was it said? There is the case, sister, where a monk hears, 'The monk named such-and-such, they say, through the ending of the fermentations, has entered & remains in the fermentation-free awareness-release & discernment-release, having known & realized them for himself in the here & now.' The thought occurs to him, 'I hope that I, too, will — through the ending of the fermentations — enter & remain in the fermentation-free awareness-release & discernment-release, having known & realized them for myself in the here & now.' Then, at a later time, he abandons craving, having relied on craving. 'This body comes into being through craving. And yet it is by relying on craving that craving is to be abandoned.' Thus was it said. And in reference to this was it said.

"'This body comes into being through conceit. And yet it is by relying on conceit that conceit is to be abandoned.' Thus was it said. And in reference to what was it said? There is the case, sister, where a monk hears, 'The monk named such-and-such, they say, through the ending of the fermentations, has entered & remains in the fermentation-free awareness-release & discernment-release, having known & realized them for himself in the here & now.' The thought occurs to him, 'The monk named such-and-such, they say, through the ending of the fermentations, has entered & remains in the fermentation-free awareness-release & discernment-release, having known & realized them for himself in the here & now. Then why not me?' Then, at a later time, he abandons conceit, having relied on conceit. 'This body comes into being through conceit. And yet it is by relying on conceit that conceit is to be abandoned.' Thus was it said, and in reference to this was it said. ...
Quote from: http://zugangzureinsicht.org/html/tipitaka/an/an04/an04.159.than_en.html

So the topic name, if using Khmer, would be "ព្រះសម្មាសម្ពុទ្ធជាអ្នក "ខ្លែងហើរ" និងអវត្តមាននៃការ"ច្រណែន" but the meaning of the words, if taken right, also explain it right in German.