Post by: Moritz on November 25, 2019, 11:24:30 PM
Venerable members of the Sangha,
valued, kalyanamittā and interested,
I am currently in progress of trying to set up everything necessary for migrating sangham.net, accesstoinsight.eu, zugangzureinsicht.org to a different provider.
Some things not yet so familiar with, but certainly able to do in principle. I am going to describe the process here to make it re-tracable and as possibility for others maybe more knowledgeable to provide hints and suggestions.
The new proposed server is located in Nuremburg, in data center of hosting company Hetzner. It is a (for now) a VPS (virtual private server) with product name "CX31".
Hardware specifications:
- 2 vcpus ("virtual cpus": each vcpu should be equivalent in performance to an Intel Xeon E5 at 2.0 GHz, according to documentation (https://wiki.hetzner.de/index.php/VServer/en), not sure how accurate)
- 8 GB RAM
- 80 GB hard disk space (used not only for the websites, but also for the operating system and all required software; can be upgraded easily and without much cost)
- 20 TB per month (TB = terabyte = 1000 gigabyte) downstream traffic (200 times as much as currently on Greensta servers), upstream unlimited
Virtual private server (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virtual_private_server), meaning it is on a machine (or more likely even multiple
distributed machines) shared with other clients, but sandboxed in its own "private" environment in a "virtual" way, so that it looks and behaves like a real self-contained independent single machine, and can be treated and managed as such.
So from a practical perspective, it looks and behaves much like a dedicated
server (https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Dedicated_server), i.e. a real physical single machine, dedicated for a single client's use, leaving full control over operating system, services running on the machine, etc. in the hands of the client.
Different from the current hosting on Greensta, the whole system with all software on it has to be set up and managed by oneself.
I believe this server would be resourceful enough to host the websites sangham.net, accesstoinsight.eu, zugangzureinsicht.org and more if
needed, and run the necessary stack of software behind and around everything, while still leaving much room for additions. In case more resources are needed, it can be easily upgraded at any time.
The reasons for choosing Hetzner:
- located in Germany (and Finland), easy to reach (by me) by phone for support
- good reputation (seen more convincing positive than negative reviews, negative were mostly regarding the branch in South Africa, which operates independently)
- using 100% "clean energy", similar like Greensta, according to website (https://www.hetzner.com/unternehmen/umweltschutz/)
- good price in comparison
The reasons for choosing a VPS, not a dedicated server, or managed webhosting (like now on Greensta):
- VPS, although having less raw power than a dedicated server, is more failsafe in case of hardware failure, having safety and redundancy
measures in place so that everything would still run smoothly on the surface, while the machinery behind might be repaired/replaced, etc. It
is easily upgradable, if needing more resources, mostly even "on the fly" without having to shut down the server for a hardware upgrade.
Both VPS and dedicated server provide full control over the (physical or virtual) machine. Managing the whole server oneself requires more work
than simple managed webhosting, but provides infinitely more possibilities to run everything on it as one needs or wants.
The current hosting on Greensta, if now soon terminated, would still run with all included packages until 2020/04/01 (April 1st, 2020). So there would be enough time to set up and migrate everything.
Technical/installation needs:
- classical LAMP stack (Linux, Apache, MySQL, PHP), based on Ubuntu 18.04 image provided by Hetzner: already installed
- E-Mail server and web interface: thinking of using iRedMail (https://www.linuxbabe.com/mail-server/ubuntu-18-04-iredmail-email-server) to set up everything, including RoundCube web interface for email (same as what is used by Greensta).
- SSL certificates: used for securely encrypted traffic/communication, but mostly, for practical purposes, just to appear "trustworthy" nowadays, where use of SSL becomes more and more common and even required in certain places, possibly even by law in certain cases. So I think it would be good to have such certificates in place.
Certificates can be very expensive. I still don't understand this whole market, and why certain providers are more or less expensive than others when acting as "trusted authority". If I understand correctly there are also certain popular and well-reputed "free" SSL certificate providers/"trusted authorities". Not sure I understand correctly. The most familiar name in this area of "free" SSL certificates would be "Let's Encrypt" (https://letsencrypt.org). I still have to read up on this, how it all works to register and set it up, and what the possible "hooks" may be.
Possibly someone else more knowledgeable in this area could fill certain gaps of understanding here. Avuso Vivek perhaps? Or our trusted administrative forefather Admin , Dmytro?
Surely there are more details to think about, and also many additional possibilities like just mentioned idea by Bhante Johann about a Dhamma "Github" alternative (http://forum.sangham.net/index.php/topic,9575.msg20791/topicseen.html#new).
Possibly, a second server might be practical as well, for example to have the email server separate, in case there are serious problems with the web server, leaving ways of communication intact.
I think I would be able to figure out by myself everything necessary for setting up the webserver, with all services and possibilities like currently provided. But any advice from people with experience in such matters would be very welcome.
_/\_ _/\_ _/\_
/me : some bbc corrected
Post by: Dhammañāṇa on December 03, 2019, 11:58:57 AM
Much success, and joy in good before, while and after doing.
Post by: Moritz on December 03, 2019, 08:03:31 PM
Post by: Vila on December 03, 2019, 10:28:40 PM
Post by: Moritz on December 05, 2019, 08:40:12 AM
Aramika 
Ein oder mehrer Beiträge wurden hier im Thema abgeschnitten und damit in neues Thema "registering a .kh domain (like sangham.kh) for the online monastery (http://forum.sangham.net/index.php?topic=9599.0)" eröffnet, dem angehäng.
One or more posts have been cut out of this topic here. A new topic, based on it, has been created as "registering a .kh domain (like sangham.kh) for the online monastery (http://forum.sangham.net/index.php?topic=9599.0)" or attached there.
Post by: Moritz on December 28, 2019, 12:13:01 PM
So any requests to zugangzureinsicht.org (http://zugangzureinsicht.org) or www.zugangzureinsicht.org (http://www.zugangzureinsicht.org) will now already be served from the new server.
Other special subdomains, like mail.zugangzureinsicht.org, imap.zugangzureinsicht.org, pop3.zugangzureinsicht.org (used for e-mail correspondence of addresses @zugangzureinsicht.org), list.zugangzureinsicht.org (for the mailing list), as well as ftp.zugangzureinsicht.org still point to the old servers at Greensta.
Software for e-mail etc. and (S)FTP access on the new server still needs to be installed/configured. I hope to be able to do that within the coming week.
The domain transfer for zugangzureinsicht.org to the new registrar Hetzner was also ordered (so that also DNS entries will then be managed from there) and should take place within the coming week if nothing goes wrong. This should not have any effects on functionality so far, if I did not make any mistake in the DNS configuration. If I did make a mistake the site will be offline at first, until corrected.
_/\_ _/\_ _/\_
Post by: Dhammañāṇa on December 28, 2019, 01:16:20 PM
All seems to work fine.
Post by: Dhammañāṇa on December 30, 2019, 07:55:06 PM
Post by: Moritz on December 31, 2019, 02:53:49 AM
As just having visited greenstas page to try to access the admin panel, they had obiviously reacted on it fast, possible even toping the new, just that you might know as possible lesser work. As they might also have maintenance, also possible lesser steady work, yet surely more flexible and more independend, if skill and means otherwise. Traffic "unlimited*" is of course very wage.No ideas in detail, just to mention.
Vandami Bhante _/\_ _/\_ _/\_
I do not quite understand what is talked about here.
But the Greensta website has been updated one or two months ago with a new look, and also some URLs of the login interface changed.
So for example, when wanting to log in to the admin panel, one is now directed to https://login.greensta.de/login/ (https://login.greensta.de/login/), which was previously used as the URL for logging in to the PHPMyAdmin database management.
So if one had saved passwords previously in the browser for this URL, they would be filled in wrong now (filling password for PHPMyAdmin instead of the general Greensta server panel). So one would have to enter the correct login name and password again by hand to log into the admin panel.
Apart from this change on the surface, everything is still working as before at Greensta. (The contracts have been cancelled of course, so that the first packages will run out on the last day of March.)
Managing everything on the new server will not be too difficult after having everything set up. Still three months time. No need to worry.
The nights after new-year I will have time to continue, step by step. I will also make accounts for SFTP access etc. and ways to manage some things through a web interface like in the Greensta server panel and share all needed for access, and some explanations when everything is well prepared.
_/\_ _/\_ _/\_
Post by: Dhammañāṇa on December 31, 2019, 06:58:44 AM
Post by: Moritz on December 31, 2019, 09:15:58 AM
Sure, it would be easier, just staying at the same. Worthy to think about if time could be used more fruitfully. Time can have much value. Still some time to decide.
_/\_ _/\_ _/\_
Post by: Dhammañāṇa on January 06, 2020, 09:30:03 PM
Atma, if that is possible, thinks that it would be good to place the wiki direct on sangham.net and make the forum a section. Using ati.eu just as redirect to wiki-pages.
Good if it would be possible to connect forum and pages better, such as a "discuss and participate" link on each wiki page, opening a new or existing topic and vici versa "create page with OP" opinion.
Essays here wouldn't be no more of need, as easier to make pages with wiki. Same with downloads. Of course it needs time to move all (and not forget redirects...) and make pages.
Uploads, attachments, not sure if they could be put into media-manager.
Just thoughts. There is also a "disscuss"-plugin, not sure if useful. Generally just thought its possible easier to "struggle" and maintain, developing, localization..., just one or a primary software. Atma likes Dokuwiki because it's all text-files, easy to handle, move, modify. How ever, reminding and aware that, as Nyom told, there are certain accessibility problems to easy and totally bridge both softwares. Also folder named equal, like"lib" might conflict.
That share of thought shouldn't cause much worry or additional work. The isn't any problem with like it is now as well.
Post by: Dhammañāṇa on January 23, 2020, 10:02:23 PM
Post by: Moritz on January 24, 2020, 04:28:56 AM
Thanks for making aware, Bhante.
Not quite sure how this happened. (But I have an idea: maybe a mistake while setting up e-mail server caused it.)
For now, it should be fixed.
I was hoping to be finished with all the preparations for a smooth transition of the other domains, and all software, like e-mail etc., ready and running, before coming to Cambodia.
Not sure now if I will be able to do everything in time. Especially e-mail is more tricky than thought. (But looks like almost done now.)
Possibly, reverting all back to Greensta managed hosting may in the end be the safer solution. (This could be done quite quickly and simply still until March.)
But for now, I remain hopeful that I can still prepare everything necessary on the new server so that the final move could be done from Cambodia with a few simple steps. At least on Sunday I should have a full free day for that.
We will see.
_/\_ _/\_ _/\_
Post by: Dhammañāṇa on January 24, 2020, 06:17:34 AM
Post by: Dhammañāṇa on January 26, 2020, 03:53:16 PM
Post by: Moritz on January 30, 2020, 03:47:37 AM
And most time was wasted setting up an e-mail server, which turns out to be the most difficult to maintain by oneself. Mostly just because large e-mail providers like to keep their dominance, and nowadays it is not easy for a small self-maintained e-mail server to get "trusted".
Mail configuration is mostly set up and configured with all settings correct on the new server.
For now, the server is set up to send and receive e-mails from ...@zugangzureinsicht.org (which is totally moved from Greensta to Hetzner for now), maybe the "least important" of the three domains dedicated for the Sangha.
One thing I forgot was the Anumodana mailing list. It is lost now, but could be set up again, with the same "mailman" software, or maybe something similar.
I think it would be good to use the new e-mail server for e-mails from ...@sangham.net and ...@accesstoinsight.eu as well to have everything maintained in one place again. But, as mentioned, the difficulty is in getting the e-mail server "trusted" by the large providers so that it will not land all automatically in spam for recipients using GMail, Outlook, Hotmail, AOL, ... I have read a lot about it and set up everything that should be required. But large providers give no transparency how they come up with their "trust". Reading experiences from others with the same headaches, it seems, things generally get better as soon as there is some e-mail traffic with some "positive engagement", i.e. recipients marking messages as "not spam" (of course they would first need to look in "spam" to find it), maybe even adding to "known contacts" or similar, possibly replying back and forth a few times, etc... Then the mail servers of large e-mail providers with their machine learning algorithms "learn" slowly to trust this new unknown server as not being a spammer.
Having tested the same setup for a different own domain and server, I have had some seemingly good success with getting e-mails from there trusted by GMail at least. So I think, with a small "engagement campaign" here, with some people here helping by marking as "not spam", replying etc., the same success could be achieved for the new server using mails ...@zugangzureinsicht.org, ...@sangham.net etc.
Maybe best to revive the Anumodana mailing list for that as a first step, using the new server, and add recipients known from the Forum who would mark them as "not spam" etc. I would make a new topic for that as soon as having set up the mailing list again and before sending out the first "Anumodana" from there.
_/\_ _/\_ _/\_
Post by: Moritz on January 30, 2020, 04:00:24 AM
And for finally moving the accesstoinsight.eu and sangham.net websites to the new servers I am going to then also prepare everything already. But the final move should better be made when being more "settled" here and forseeable having time to deal with possible unexpected troubles. (Also, I think the "auth-codes" for moving the domains are probably already expired, and would need to be asked for another time from Greensta. Still time, better to do that when Bang Sophorn is back in Austria.)
If having more similar quiet time like now I think lots of other useful things could be done here. :)
_/\_ _/\_ _/\_
Post by: Dhammañāṇa on January 30, 2020, 05:02:59 AM
Email: honestly, if people are wished to be caught in the prisons of industry, then they should so. As my person always says, one has to leave home or palace first to get Dhamma know. No need to join the war or get much in trade.
Atma thinks that if all is nearly an intranet, it's also well.
It's like at the Ashram here. It's no lose (for those on path) that there is just a small path and so it's actually no lose for the Sangha to get cut off.
Good how ever, if Nyom wins some distance to the internet realm and endless tasks fist.
Post by: Dhammañāṇa on January 30, 2020, 07:06:49 AM
My person is not sure in how far the knowledge-able Venerables are interested in assistance, quite withdrawn from world and philosophical hypocrisy, but my person has the feeling that Bhante Ariyadhammika is one who can gain certain Vision (has not fallen into certain modern delusions), might have touched the spirit of the Buddhas disciples, and maybe willing to assist for the long term existance of the Savaka Sangha. It's possible good if Nyom ask's personally, direct, for assistance to errect a suiteable dwelling and "social-system" for the Sangha in modern world. Bhante
If there are ways to come to an account on sanghan.net, Atma actually sees no reason for the need of own email adress. What for? And if there would be need to correspond outside, devoted lay people could deliver messages.
There had been also ideas that a certain sub-forum might function as a income place for mails.
Post by: Moritz on January 30, 2020, 11:25:49 AM
Sadhu. I had similar thoughts, so am glad to hear confirmation of my opinion that approval from Microsoft, Google & Co. is not so much needed.
I just thought, good to preserve whatever possibilities existed on the old servers, including e-mail, which I think is useful to have for the Sangha in its own domain.
So I will try to start to switch e-mail service over to the new server as soon as possible, maybe already this evening. It needs some overlay time, a while where both servers will still work for sending, and to give notice to all e-mail users that server settings will change soon etc., as well as set up some forwarding for the interim time from the old to the new.
Anumodana mailing list is also alomst finished to revive now. A small internal "campaign" of sending and answering / marking as "not spam" of e-mails by active participants in the forum might help a bit without much "fight" or harm, and maybe also useful to transport the message that new server is being used from now on / soon.
As long as being in Phnom Penh this all seems to be a good use of the time.
Now going with Bang Sophorn to meet Pou Vithou for talking about visa matters.
_/\_ _/\_ _/\_
Post by: Moritz on March 05, 2020, 08:46:12 PM
Quoted from other topic (http://forum.sangham.net/index.php?topic=9773), linking all together, just to bring it back here to the origin.
_/\_ _/\_ _/\_
Actually, the "merge" would be the last step in the whole server migration (http://forum.sangham.net/index.php?topic=9578.msg20796#msg20796).
Just to make a bit clearer what is supposed to happen here:
The forum is now already moved to http://forum.sangham.net (http://forum.sangham.net) (as people will have noticed when visiting here) and hosted on the new server.
The idea of the "merge", as suggested by Bhante, is to make the DokuWiki (currently at http://accesstoinsight.eu (http://accesstoinsight.eu), and currently still on the old server) the primary focus of the Sangha's domain here, and move it to http://sangham.net (http://sangham.net).
The forum will then just have a "secondary" place here, now already on the subdomain forum.sangham.net (http://forum.sangham.net).
Then there are ideas about connecting the two more: making it possible to start a forum discussion from a DokuWiki page, to archive old forum discussions into the DokuWiki...
But these are for now just ideas, not with a complete concept yet.
The main idea is just to more emphasize the focus of this domain as a working place for puñña and Dhammadana, where discussion should better be more linked to the "place of work"/kammathana maintained in the DokuWiki for the Sangha.
_/\_ _/\_ _/\_
Then there were also ideas about a Sangham messenger, making it possible to have communications with the same convenience of WhatsApp and Telegram properly within the domain of the Sangha, and also what software to possibly use for that. I think that would surely be possible with the new server. Not sure how quickly to do.
/me As brother Vivek had mentioned some vaguely similar ideas and suggestions (http://forum.sangham.net/index.php?topic=9701.msg21706#msg21706), he might be interested, at least technically, as a learner in this "profession", to hear about how it works. Not asking for help (which would not be really possible). Just to inform.
Post by: Moritz on March 05, 2020, 08:51:45 PM
It is a bit time-consuming. And a logicistical problem, to keep it running smoothly most of the time, possibly for a short period using both servers.
Probably it would be necessary to set new passwords for all e-mail addresses.
I will try to figure out and send a message to all accounts about coming changes. Might take still a few days to set it all up.
_/\_ _/\_ _/\_
Post by: Dhammañāṇa on March 06, 2020, 08:19:36 PM
Atma came across that the size of medias upload-able via media manager seems to be limited to 2MB and it might be that it is a php setting according to dokuwiki info: https://www.dokuwiki.org/faq:uploadsize
My person also didn't see the usual delete option in the media manager for existing media files.
Post by: Moritz on March 07, 2020, 07:50:04 AM
Now, big file uploads, up to 100MB, should be working.
FTP accounts, I will add soon.
Post by: Moritz on April 10, 2020, 07:25:16 PM
Sorry, I missed to inform further, being more busy getting used to this new environment (which I still am not familiar with).
Yesterday (maybe until today) there was just one last hickup from the migration. The domain sangham.net was suspended for a short time, because the domain transfer had still to be confirmed by Upasika Sophorn, being the official "holder", of which I had not informed her earlier, not knowing it clearly myself.
But the issue was quickly resolved with Sophorn's help. Sadhu!
_/\_ _/\_ _/\_
Post by: Dhammañāṇa on April 19, 2020, 09:27:54 PM