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2020 May 30 07:05:43
Cheav Villa: _/\_  _/\_ _/\_

2020 May 30 06:51:35
Johann: Those taking on the Uposatha today: may many follow your encouragement when leading after near and those depending on you.

2020 May 29 20:39:55
Cheav Villa: _/\_  _/\_ _/\_

2020 May 29 19:56:20
Johann: What ever sacrificed toward the Sublime Gems, toward liberation, such is condition for no more flowing back into the world. Mudita

2020 May 29 08:40:16
Cheav Villa: _/\_  _/\_ _/\_

2020 May 29 08:34:50
Johann: [continue] ...kāma-guṇa (sensual giving) , death, alive, increasing the cemeteries in the world. This is why just giving toward the virtuous, those with metta, bears fruits beyond the common, as it's not for further kāma-guṇa that they would use it for, but as base for lessons, for purificatio

2020 May 29 08:33:20
Cheav Villa: _/\_  _/\_ _/\_

2020 May 29 08:27:03
Johann: If one would know or remembering the suffering behind pleasing form, sound, smell, taste, touch, one certain would no more desire after it. But because lof lack of remembering and proper attention, beings go after it, take birth, age, get sick, seperated, die, again and again, keeping the flame of k

2020 May 29 08:15:29
Cheav Villa: _/\_  _/\_ _/\_

2020 May 29 08:15:19
Cheav Villa: _/\_  _/\_ _/\_

2020 May 29 07:42:53
Johann: If ones sacrifices, generosity, isn't protected by a good closed tank, less fruits can be expected. And what is the tank made of? Saddha, Pasada, metta, Sila, intention for own and others independency.

2020 May 29 06:36:24
Johann: A blessed Siladay all who are doing it today

2020 May 28 19:24:28
Johann: Sadhu

2020 May 28 18:32:00
Moritz: Upgrade to SMF 2.0.17 has been completed. Everything running smooth for everybody?

2020 May 23 06:43:43
Cheav Villa: _/\_  _/\_ _/\_

2020 May 22 21:09:34
Johann: May all still continue to spend a blessed New moon Uposatha till break on of a new day (of course good to continue without break). Mudita

2020 May 21 20:16:55
Cheav Villa: _/\_  _/\_ _/\_

2020 May 21 19:30:50
Johann: Nothing more a blessing as to do not cling to a specific Nikaya, since one can easy take the opportunity of doing theUposatha often two days a new. May all always make the best of given possibilities.

2020 May 20 21:19:41
Johann: Sadhu

2020 May 20 20:44:31
Cheav Villa: May Bhante get well soon.  _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2020 May 20 20:43:13
Cheav Villa: Vandami Bhante _/\_ _/\_  _/\_

2020 May 18 14:55:14
Cheav Villa: Vandami Bhante _/\_ _/\_  _/\_

2020 May 18 12:17:04
Khemakumara: Upāsikā

2020 May 17 21:21:28
Johann: Nyom Sophorn

2020 May 17 07:36:11
Cheav Villa: Vandami Bhante _/\_ _/\_  _/\_

2020 May 17 07:14:16
Khemakumara: Upāsikā

2020 May 17 06:01:03
Khemakumara:  _/\_ _/\_ _/\_ Bhante

2020 May 16 20:42:01
Johann: Bhante

2020 May 15 20:13:51
Cheav Villa: Sadhu Sadhu Sadhu _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2020 May 15 19:17:25
Johann: A blessed Siladay ending for those who keep(ed) it today.

2020 May 14 09:09:08
Cheav Villa: _/\_  _/\_ _/\_

2020 May 14 06:17:12
Johann: A bl3ssed Sila-day those observing it today.

2020 May 12 21:00:24
Cheav Villa: Sadhu Sadhu Sadhu _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2020 May 12 19:10:56
Johann: May no one ever, even a moment, forget: "Sole dominion over the earth, going to heaven, lordship over all worlds:    the fruit of stream-entry    excels them."

2020 May 10 15:27:11
Depabhasadhamma: Thank you Johann

2020 May 10 15:26:00
Johann: "stand", taking, holding a stand makes it possible more understandable and fits better to it.

2020 May 10 15:24:35
Johann: Welcome Depabasadhamma, Atma will open a topic on it.

2020 May 10 15:04:51
Depabhasadhamma: I am in need of assistance. I am writing a paper about the Three Marks of Existence. I understand the three marks, however, I am befuddled by the meaning and use of the word "existence." Is this English word the translation of the Pali word thiti? Does the word "existence" imply life, living, consci

2020 May 09 21:15:38
Cheav Villa: _/\_  _/\_ _/\_ :)

2020 May 09 20:48:57
Johann: Apsara in Pali: accharā, translation actually "A Whoo!"

2020 May 09 20:45:38
Johann: "...“Then take joy, Nanda. Take joy! I am your guarantor for getting 500 dove-footed nymphs.”..."

2020 May 09 20:45:17
Johann: "“What do you think, Nanda? Which is lovelier, better looking, more charming: the Sakyan girl, the envy of the countryside, or these 500 dove-footed nymphs?”..."

2020 May 09 20:43:26
Johann: There was a Bhikkhu "who got an email from an ex-co-dweller" and thought he will return to lower life, Nyom: Nanda Sutta

2020 May 09 20:35:41
Johann: It's actually just about the clothes, since his livemode is already a great Samaneras one.

2020 May 09 20:33:48
Cheav Villa: Bhante _/\_ _/\_  _/\_ I kana never heard about the Bhuddha promised..  _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2020 May 09 20:33:17
Johann: Till end of Vassa maybe?

2020 May 09 20:25:18
Cheav Villa: Master Moritz _/\_ Should try an ordination which in 7days.  _/\_ :)

2020 May 09 20:16:21
Johann: Apsara (dove feet Devatas).

2020 May 09 20:13:19
Johann: Temporary ordination is pretty normal, 3 days, a month, a Vassa... and not to forget that the Buddha promised union with the Asparas, which are beyond being compareable to others...

2020 May 09 19:25:54
Moritz: No no, I really prefer to be a householder, even though not having a house at the moment. I am not much inclined towards nekkhamma...  ^-^
... even though already doing some nekkhamma now, but not hoping to do so for the long term....

2020 May 09 19:24:05
Moritz: Bang Villa _/\_

2020 May 09 19:08:20
Cheav Villa: _/\_  _/\_ _/\_

2020 May 09 19:00:58
Johann: When not working he is already used to where his beige light clean cloth, morning, noon, evening and already good organized.

2020 May 09 18:52:05
Cheav Villa: Kana Bhante _/\_ _/\_ _/\_ :)

2020 May 09 18:39:04
Johann: Nyom has his working dress and his light formal dress. White he might have possible to much troubles, so better to convince him toward robes.  :)

2020 May 09 17:38:39
Cheav Villa: Vandami Bhante _/\_ _/\_  _/\_ Master Moritz should wear white clothes.  _/\_ _/\_ _/\_ :)

2020 May 07 15:18:07
Cheav Villa: _/\_  _/\_ _/\_

2020 May 07 10:33:24
Johann: Householder clothes are really no more proper for Upasaka Khemadasa.... good to take him fear of the robes

2020 May 07 10:21:10
Khemakumara: Upāsikā

2020 May 07 10:19:33
Cheav Villa: Vandami Bhante _/\_ _/\_  _/\_

2020 May 07 06:02:32
Cheav Villa: Sadhu Sadhu Sadhu _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2020 May 07 05:46:38
Johann: Sadhu

2020 May 07 03:25:02
Khemakumara: May it be a path-and fruitful vesak Uposatha

2020 May 06 16:07:14
Cheav Villa: Sadhu Sadhu Sadhu _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2020 May 06 16:02:35
Johann: A blessed Vesaka Puja all, today and tomorrow, in reflection the goodness and qualities of the Sublime Buddha.

2020 May 04 21:25:10
Johann: followed by another overload by huawei-search engines... fixed

2020 May 04 20:31:45
Cheav Villa: _/\_  _/\_ _/\_

2020 May 04 20:25:53
Johann: A MS search engine (Bing) had overloaded the server capacity and might had caused the page not to be reached, but a cave-programmer quickly solved the issue, becoming aware of it. Sadhu

2020 May 03 21:13:46
Cheav Villa: Vandami Bhante Ariyadhammika _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2020 May 03 20:32:57
Cheav Villa: _/\_  _/\_ _/\_

2020 May 03 19:15:52
Johann: Sokh chomreoun, Nyom.

2020 May 03 15:01:43
Cheav Villa: Vandami Bhante _/\_ _/\_  _/\_

2020 May 03 12:53:08
Cheav Villa: Master Moritz _/\_

2020 May 03 12:07:17
Moritz: Bang Villa _/\_

2020 May 03 12:00:57
Cheav Villa: _/\_  _/\_ _/\_

2020 May 03 09:39:36
Johann: ...and the snake hunts the mice...

2020 May 03 09:11:20
Johann: Dwelling like Devas under Devas, peaceful, respectful, careful, harmless

2020 Apr 30 10:05:08
Cheav Villa: Sadhu Sadhu Sadhu _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2020 Apr 29 21:15:43
Moritz: _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2020 Apr 29 21:08:53
Johann: May all spend a meritful end of Sila-day, those who taking on it today, and maybe continue with those doing so tomorrow.

2020 Apr 29 20:09:39
Johann: Nyom Villa

2020 Apr 29 20:07:29
Cheav Villa: Vandami Bhante _/\_ _/\_  _/\_

2020 Apr 26 20:26:31
Johann: Nyom Moritz, Nyom Villa

2020 Apr 26 20:23:57
Cheav Villa: and Master Moritz _/\_

2020 Apr 26 20:23:33
Cheav Villa: Vandami Bhante _/\_ _/\_  _/\_

2020 Apr 26 19:56:30
Moritz: Bang Villa _/\_

2020 Apr 26 19:56:25
Moritz: Vandami Bhante _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2020 Apr 26 08:18:19
Cheav Villa: _/\_  _/\_ _/\_

2020 Apr 26 07:18:02
Johann: Ādīnava , អដីនវ, As one of ten perceptions: AN 10.60

2020 Apr 26 07:09:32
Johann: May Dukkha be visible for all, so to stay on the path  that leads beyond and liberation.

2020 Apr 25 16:57:34
Cheav Villa: Vandami Bhante _/\_ _/\_  _/\_

2020 Apr 25 15:54:00
Khemakumara: Upāsikā

2020 Apr 23 18:41:59
Johann: Sadhu for care to report and assist

2020 Apr 23 18:39:44
Cheav Villa: Vandami Bhante _/\_ _/\_  _/\_ I kana now not get notification.  _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2020 Apr 23 15:04:07
Cheav Villa: Vandami Bhante _/\_ _/\_  _/\_

2020 Apr 23 13:45:57
Khemakumara: Upāsikā

2020 Apr 22 11:17:56
Johann: Sadhu, Sadhu

2020 Apr 22 06:38:01
Cheav Villa: Sadhu Sadhu Sadhu _/\_ _/\_ _/\_ :)

2020 Apr 22 05:45:37
Khemakumara: karuṇā, corona? which one prefers?   may it a fruit- and pathful Uposatha!

2020 Apr 21 19:53:51
Johann: If Nyom likes to use Atmas tablet and Sim, just pick it up at any time.

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Author Topic: Assimilating of Bhante Samahita's death, decay of beloved  (Read 607 times)

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Offline Johann

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Re: Assimilating of Bhante Samahita's death, decay of beloved
« Reply #30 on: March 13, 2020, 12:46:25 PM »
Good then, and no problem the delay (what would come was already clear).

So out of compassion and not a sample to follow, as well, here:

Let my person ask now for Nyom gvg s next meeting with her trusted Monks:

* whether the senior Bhikkhus, in the case my person would be a Bhikkhu, did a transgression in as far as they told about a fault of another Bhikkhu toward a lay person, unless they are not given by the Sangha to do so

* whether they did even a more grave transgression, in the case the younger Monk isn't a "Bhikkhu".

* whether intention plays a role in regard of the transgression.

* whether it's given to talk with woman on such matters in even extended form, possible alone.

* What the kammical consequences for someone would be who criticises an even Noble Fellow (or monk) possible wrongly.

Then, as they lead Nyom right into the sphere of hell (as my person has no contact of this gain-desiring monks, doing favours for angry laywoman), ask them about the results if criticising wrongly, or even criticising (as such could be the case as well) a Noble One. For it is simply foolish and how ever old they might be, the Venerables have to be called fools, to tell a lay person that there is nothing wrong in criticising a monk, categorically.

As told already, there is nothing more dangerous as to associate with fools.

And then let my person add that an undertaking of wishing to split the Sangha, although just as a lay person, if touching case Noble ones, could also easy lead to a downfall transgression, one of the six kammas which lead straight to hell and hinder from what ever attaining upwardly in this existence.  That was told for the case in which one might not have asked honestly but with certain deceitful intentions and then carries things in between.

So again, it's total foolish to believe that critic is bad and praise is good, but depends on sacca. Hopefully Nyom can see the hypotactic within all that and may she gives what ever good causes to get never in association with fools.

And yes, it's important to reflect that there are monks who can read mind and know actually well what will be next, is hidden, can be changed at this time, in this circumstances.

At least, best Greetings to the Venerables and good to tell them, that if letting go of desire for gain, it's easier to associate with monks, doesn't need improper dependency and association with lay people and would be not only for the own welfare but also for a long lasting of the Sangha. But if monks are hanging like calves on the breast of a cow, fear of lacking nutrition through lack of doing favours, that it's difficult for them, inwardly and outwardly as well.

As the Sublime Buddha also often accounted, even for ones disciples, when they act very foolish, the teacher(s) have to be called fools, because they didn't taught well.

Just for the case the Venerables would seek for solving transgressions and might not know: important for confessing a transgression is to find someone pure in this regard (not with same transgression) and it's total fine if finding a very youngster to do so. And it's also good not to receive an amend, if having actually the same fault carry with oneself, since such would then possible not really purify the one who makes confession or increases his wrong views.

And good of course if Nyom, rather than to run hidden around and make possible unskillful undertakings by breaking peoples apart, would be if she tries to lay out a bridge and tell the Venerables that they are more then welcome to make use of all possibilities here. Sure, such could be of cause strong again ones personal interests, could it? But there would lie a big change for grow.

And to give the most "funny" info, since Nyom said "I will not investigate in detail", the critic toward the late Bhikkhu was made by a formal lay person at this time, who invited a Bhikkhu, translated his teachings and, to take care on law and his reputation, removed stolen pictures in the translations, was therefore rebuked by him, aside that he criticised his wish to share teachings foremost to older and lonely people, since that would bring the best results and gains...

It's really foolish to act in such ways, Nyom, and it's even more foolish to take not only side but side with fools and what is called "notorious wrong does, not able to be corrected".

Whether it's a blessing to associate with fools or get disappointed of what is good to gain disappointment, that lies in the sphere of Nyoms judgement and ability to see through the net of defilements and desires.

For those who could gain health:

Namo tassa bhagavato arahato sammā-sambuddhassa

Avannaraha Sutta: Dispraise

“Bhikkhus, one possessing four qualities is deposited in hell as if brought there. What four? (1) Without investigating and scrutinizing, one speaks praise of one who deserves dispraise. (2) Without investigating and scrutinizing, one speaks dispraise of one who deserves praise. (3) Without investigating and scrutinizing, one believes a matter that merits suspicion. (4) Without investigating and scrutinizing, one is suspicious about a matter that merits belief. Possessing these four qualities one is deposited in hell as if brought there.

“Bhikkhus, one possessing four [other] qualities is deposited in heaven as if brought there. What four? (1) Having investigated and scrutinized, one speaks dispraise of one who deserves dispraise. (2) Having investigated and scrutinized, one speaks praise of one who deserves praise. (3) Having investigated and scrutinized, one is suspicious about a matter that merits suspicion. (4) Having investigated and scrutinized, one believes a matter that merits belief. Possessing these four qualities one is deposited in heaven as if brought there.”

It's hard to give more then this for ones long term happiness and not sure if another is capable to take and grow with it.
« Last Edit: March 13, 2020, 01:17:32 PM by Johann »
This post and Content has come to be by Dhamma-Dana and so is given as it       Dhamma-Dana: Johann

Offline Johann

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Re: Assimilating of Bhante Samahita's death, decay of beloved
« Reply #31 on: March 13, 2020, 01:40:06 PM »
So, this story answer your question when you asked me if I was not afraid of criticizing a monk because you also didn't like it to be criticized by a lay person.

And this, just to address it, would be a total wrong perception, for one who dislikes critic such is indeed a fool (for a Bhikkhu it would be an offence if disrespecting critic by lay people). And Nyom has in no way to fear any disadvantages from my persons side, whether her acting was actually foolish or not. Atma isn't capable to bear things like even ill-will and beings do wrong simply out of not-knowing of which they wouldn't if they know. Nevertheless, such wouldn't not protect from kammic consequences and that is the most important matter here: investigating what actually dives one and not out of reason the topic is called "Assimilating of Bhante Samahita's death, decay of beloved" since such, if done wrong, leads only to more suffering and to really foolish actions.
This post and Content has come to be by Dhamma-Dana and so is given as it       Dhamma-Dana: Johann

Offline Johann

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Re: Assimilating of Bhante Samahita's death, decay of beloved
« Reply #32 on: March 13, 2020, 03:12:30 PM »
There arose recently a question on another place, Nyom gvg , which might be good to consider here as well, since wisdom should always be put above "right and wrong":

Quote from: Johann
Quote from: Erik Kaplun on BSE
Should any monastic be considered a noble one?

Should every monastic unconditionally be considered a noble one, and treated as such, to abstain from bad kamma at the very least? or are lay people, and other monastics, free to use personal judgement based on the personal qualities, or lack thereof, of a given monastic?

If the latter, then am I free to verbally express my concern/blame, without producing excessively bad kamma? For example due to not agreeing with the way the Dhamma is presented, or timing thereof, or not agreeing with the arrogant attitude of the monk, or pointing out flaws in the behavior/methods/views of that monk?

Taken that a good friend would give you advices to abstain from things which could harm you or of bad results, what advices would you give, being in such a possition, knowing that cause and effect isn't a democratical thing, or a "liberal"? Would you send him in an easy fatal lost "war" to win his favor, give into possible defilements?

While it is a very seldom gift of being well-wished adviced, even if disliking, think on you as a child and your parents, it's not something you are obligated to and so worthy to think clear why wishing to do, honest.

Just a sample, not to present something, but to have a possibility to think maybe more from outside, as life actually runs different as thought, as just one to give: Assimilating of Bhante Samahita's death, decay of beloved

For on ordinary person it's really hard to keep preoccupations, feeling... separated, not to speak of understanding of what possible just known from far.

So it's really not an easy issue if serious wishing to build up Nissay with those headed toward liberation, not even if after good, firm, intellectual understanding.

May all take care and often remember their parents hardship to even letting have grown till here.

For all that reason, since the old, people are adviced to focus their dedications toward the Sangha and others then the most think, the Buddha gave also to householders advices of how to react on "troublesome" monks, since thinks aren't for sure! And the Buddha knew his Pappenheimer:

Namo tassa bhagavato arahato sammā-sambuddhassa

    ...Anāthapiṇḍika the householder heard that, “They say that the Kosambī monks, quarrelsome, makers of strife, makers of disputes, makers of rumors, makers of issues in the Saṅgha, are coming to Sāvatthī.”

    Then Anāthapiṇḍika the householder went to the Blessed One and, on arrival, having bowed down to him, sat to one side. As he was sitting there, he said to the Blessed One, “Lord, they say that the Kosambī monks, quarrelsome, makers of strife, makers of disputes, makers of rumors, makers of issues in the Saṅgha, are coming to Sāvatthī. How am I to behave with regard to these monks?”...The Discussion of the Eighteen Grounds

Old lay people in tradition countries, wouldn't advice or support one, nearly generally, especially if having been monks, but of course they had no google and suttacentral-monks, which might be useful or will most eternal cut of the stream of those rest heading already outward. So again, right critic leads to heaven (even if just by ones thought) and wrong likewise to hell. So the proverbs of binding a knot into your tongue aren't out of reason, one can be sure, and for good deeds one does not need to become a "killer", not even one who struggles outwardly long. In both directions, and the rest stays open for real compassion and seldom left paramis one could have.

And to add an important issue, kamma, and that's what the most here is about, doesn't care whether you then tell wrong just your friend, spread it secretly or anonymously... a larg bypass downstairs as well, by especially "smart".

There should be no issue better to simply direct the case direct, and if no "success", one can deside to left another off for one self, not even just at least.

(Note that this isn't given for trade, exchange, stacks or what ever binds, but for freedom from it.)

This post and Content has come to be by Dhamma-Dana and so is given as it       Dhamma-Dana: Johann